Post reply

Warning: this topic has not been posted in for at least 60 days.
Unless you're sure you want to reply, please consider starting a new topic.
Message icon:

Verification: Search engine are not allowed to complete captchas

shortcuts: hit alt+s to submit/post or alt+p to preview

Topic Summary

Posted by: Doug K
« on: June 14, 2020, 12:29:10 pm »

Interesting you should mention the Slope Ratio... this is what the NYS Canal Corporation has stated they will follow, the NYS DEC Guidelines from their website.

According to this there are TWO slope angles allowed... 2:1 and 3:1, the latter is preferred as it is less steep and easier to mow. The steeper slope comes with a "condition" if it is used. If the steeper grade is used, there MUST be a Tow drain installed to collect phreatic & run-off water located at the Toe of the embankment dam's outboard slope.

This just might help MANY canal neighbors that have water issues, we fixed our own Toe drain and our sump pump has not been used since.
Posted by: Michael Caswell
« on: June 11, 2020, 04:50:47 pm »

And never one word from the STCC about WHY they NYPA want to clear the trees! 

Come on, WHY?

It's because these dams are DANGEROUS, liable to collapse, and the entire population living to the west of the canal from 31F to Bushnells Basin are in a DAM HAZARD ZONE, liable to catastrophic flood.

What makes matters worse is the trees are mostly Cottonwoods, shallow rooted, with weak limbs.
Most trees are 150 feet tall, with trunk bases of at least 3 feet diameter, meaning they weigh about 10 tons each.
They are over 100 feet tall, perched precariously on a man made dirt slope with a pitch under 45 degrees.
The ratio of height to base line is less than 1:1.  It should be 3:1
There is a tremendous amount of hydro-static pressure exerted from the water in the canal.
The amount of brush on these dams is so dense, Engineers reports state that inspection for leak was impossible.

To sum this all up, the trees must be removed, the public liability cost of failure would run into billions. It would bankrupt the Perinton, Pittsford and Brighton.

And ONE drowning would be one too many. Totally avoidable!

Posted by: Doug K
« on: June 11, 2020, 12:49:47 pm »'s a good trait to have, unless you are on the wrong side of the facts & truth about a given situation, like Erie Canal Safety.

Here's the latest from the Facebook Group, calling itself Stop the Canal Clear-Cut. This time the leaders are once again stymied by their refusal to acknowledge that the work on earthen embankments isn't about harvesting trees, like the groups name implies, it's really about the safety & "health" of the canal system, it's embankment dams and the public living around this waterway. It's about public safety and the sustainability of the Canal System.

STCC Leadership still has zero answers to that safety question, especially in light of the new draft Generic Environmental Impact Statement (dGEIS) that has been published by the NYS Canal Corporation. That document basically says that all trees will be removed from NYS Canal System Embankments, especially earthen dams that have been deemed unsafe. Its says trees go, grass is grown and all is good.

You can read that statement here :

Here's the comments that go along with the "Help Wanted" post

What's truly amazing though is that consistency part of the STCC Group... and how they continue to twist the truth and use their "own facts" instead of known facts. It's about beating the dead horse... trees were all cut in the areas this group talks about most. They rarely talk about the unsafe dams in their own backyards.

Now this group's leader is worried about the idea that the NYS Canal Corporation is using a new "Historical Reference", as a reason for clearing canal embankments of trees. The NYS Barge Canal is a man-made canal, and most canals around the world, especially with raised earthen dams making up canal walls, are usually covered in well maintained grass.  As many see in New York State, that is not the case with our canal system and these earth embankments.

So the Canal Corporation & new owner New York Power Authority have undertaken their new EEIP work to rectify all of this and put things back to "like new" condition. Keep in mind these dams are now 100 years old and failing.

So the STCC Leaders show some turn of the century postcards of the ORIGINAL ERIE CANAL and try to make their members believe the two canals are the same. They are banking on the nostalgia factor of an Erie Canal no one alive has seen. And they also care little whether they show flat land with trees or raised embankments with trees...because there is a BIG difference. It's all hype to prove their point that the old Erie Canal had trees on it.

And it BROKE ALL THE TIME, that's why the new one was built...

The Canal Corporation is NOT clearing anything but Raised Embankment Dams along the NYS Barge Canal System.

I hate to be the one to break the news to the Stop the Canal Clear-cut group but... the Erie Canal is dead, most of it at least. It's been replaced, about 100 years ago. No mules were walking on this trail, No "low bridge, everybody down" on this canal...that was the old one. It's all there if they want to read.

Don't be fooled folks. The Earthen Embankment Dams that make up 125 miles of the NYS Canal System are better off WITHOUT TREES... so says New York State DEC.

Or you can believe a group of people who can't see the "dams" because they can't get past the fact that TREES are in the way...