Author Topic: Facing Defeat, Facebook's Stop the Canal Clear-Cut Group Starts to Grasps Straws  (Read 106 times)

Doug K

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So far this Facebook group has tried every ploy possible, to stand in the way of Embankment Dam Safety Work along the Erie Canal.

First it was "clear-cutting", they cried foul and said that the NYS canal Corporation was simply clearing trees along the canal for profit, selling the rotted wood for cold hard cash to fill their pockets.

Then the STCC group tried to fight against the term "Dam Safety", which they know requires clearing all trees and planting grass on dam slopes. They did that by claiming falsely, that these embankments really weren't dams at all, they were "levees". Their levee experts were refuted, and not one DAM Engineer or Expert in the art of impounding water agreed with them. So they gave that ruse up.

Next they claimed that we, the public using the Erie Canal Trail, would have "loss of oxygen" that these trees helped provide. After all, everyone knows that trees absorb CO2 and release O2. Sadly that was also debunked by experts, who showed that dead trees don't help, and many of the trees removed from these unsafe embankments were dead ones. That argument ended of course, they moved on.

That brought them to their "shade defense", and how everyone using the trail was going to burn up and fry in the sun.

Not sure how this group thought that argument would fly, especially on a pedestrian trail that is predominately running in an east-west direction across the State. Trees are NOT helping to shade the trail that much, except in a few sections of the Canal Path that run north to south. The groups leadership just happens to live near a N-S section in Fairport.

So now it's looking like this Facebook Group is ramping up their "endangered species" defense to keep trees.

Like somehow the ONLY trees that an eagle might use, are the ones located on the canal embankments. Somehow they have tried to convince themselves, and their members, that a passing eagle, in migration mode, constitutes a reason to stop a public safety dam repair. Really?





It is certainly amazing, and anyone would have to give them credit for thinking out of the box, trying to fabricate one excuse after another, to stop a public safety program that is trying to SAVE the Erie canal they claim to "love".

Just a reminder from a prior post on the ECNA Forum as the New York Canal Corporation and New York Power Authority already anticipated this "maneuver" and have put the necessary measures in place to prevent another stoppage, even a fake on based on a Bald Eagle or any other animal that this groups wants to save.



https://ecna.createaforum.com/erie-canal-embankment-integrity-program-(eip)/final-generic-environmental-statement-released-for-eeip-embankment-work/


Never mind that while this Facebook group is trying to save squirrels, bunnies and birds, there are tens of thousands of HUMANS at risk of potential embankment breaches and floods. That doesn't seem that important to a group or leaders that have certainly lost their way in all of this embankment "saving".

It appears that this Facebook group has also lost the most important part of any embankment dam safety discussion.. that would be the TRUTH.


Here's a little more information about the NY State Endangered Species laws, please read more using the links provided.







https://codes.findlaw.com/ny/environmental-conservation-law/env-sect-11-0535.html

https://govt.westlaw.com/nycrr/Browse/Home/NewYork/NewYorkCodesRulesandRegulations?guid=Ia8d30760b5a011dda0a4e17826ebc834&transitionType=Default&contextData=%28sc.Default%29



And the simple fact is that the Canal Corporation DOES have permits in hand to deal with Bald Eagles, wayward woodchucks, rascal rabbits... and even the likes of Elizabeth Agte and Ginny Maier, nipping at their heels.

This new ploy by the Stop the Canal Clear-Cut group, like all the rest, will not be based in facts or science. It will be based on their leaders' "gut feel" & "humble opinions". And most of their membership will agree with this nonsense, because they can't figure out they are being fed a boatload of crap sandwiches.

They will keep talking about this new plan of saying "I saw an endangered or protected species" until it fails, like all the rest of the sorry excuses they have made up so far. You would think they would have learned by now that they can't simply "make up facts" that support ideas that are wrong in the first place.

And this STCC charade continues on, all because the group's LEADERS will NOT admit there is a SAFETY PROBLEM along the NYS Canal System with high-hazard, tree covered, embankment dams.

And because they really have no argument that says it's OK to leave unsafe Earthen Canal Dams in our midst...


« Last Edit: February 09, 2021, 02:45:10 pm by Doug K »

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Doug K

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It never fails to amaze the ECNA that so many people, apparently with little to no intelligence, could end up in the same Facebook group, fighting against initiatives that work to promote & encourage public safety initiatives. But that seems to be required to become part of this Stop the Canal Clear-Cut (STCC) Group.

Now that statement may seem "harsh" to some, but it's also the truth, please read on.

What else can be said about a group that tries to "invent" their own story on public safety, and make statements on their Facebook site about topics they know little or nothing about and also FAIL to do any kind of research to understand the "real truth"?

This groups has always operated on one cardinal rule - Make up your own truth, as long as it fits the group's narrative that the Canal Corporation is "evil".

Here's their latest rant and complaint about fixing another DANGEROUS embankment, this time along the Genesee River where the Canal & River joined, an area in Rochester called Corn Hill.






Now you might think this all looks great and makes sense, as long as you were part of the Stop the Canal Clear-Cut debacle.

But further investigation reveals that this is just another effort by the NYS Canal Corporation to clear an unsafe embankment, fix an aging, crumbling and dangerous retaining wall to stop flooding (also called a dam). All anyone has to do is look up information on this project which is readily available. There have been news stories on this work, and there is also a published West River Wall Master Plan.

Again, you have to LOOK for the Truth BEFORE you start to claim you know it all

Unless you happen to be in the STCC, where you can just make it all up to suit your needs and stir up your fake environmental group.





https://www.cityofrochester.gov/wrwimprovement/


And if you read the MASTER PLAN you will find even more information about this crumbling water impounding structure...known as a Dam.



https://www.dos.ny.gov/opd/programs/pdfs/Rochester%20LWRP_draftAmd_AppV.pdf

This story has been covered in the NEWS - https://www.wxxinews.org/post/corn-hill-river-wall-be-replaced

This revitalization plan is being welcomed with open arms by those NEIGHBORS in the Corn Hill area.

https://cornhill.org/new-riverfront-coming-to-corn-hill-at-last/


But the Stop the Canal Clear-Cut group doesn't want to hear about what "others might think, they have their own "truth" that says any work on the Erie Canal is wrong, unnecessary, and isn't fixing anything... because they still believe "there is no danger along the Erie Canal".

Of course, NOTHING COULD BE FURTHER FROM THE TRUTH


Now if you are wondering what all this Erie Canal work is about, it's easy.. it's about SAFETY of the Erie Canal System and SAFETY of those living near it. But do NOT take the work of the ECNA about that, you only need to listen to the New York State Comptroller, who has been talking about the unsafe Canal System since 2015.




https://www.osc.state.ny.us/press/releases/2015/05/dinapoli-canal-corp-must-address-gaps?redirect=legacy


Not sure what else can be said here, other than hopefully some will learn a VALUABLE lesson from those who refuse to to listen to the facts and the science.

Before you start talking about a subject, especially like Public Safety along the NYS Canal System, and you are claiming to have "all the answers" and be an "expert", you just may want to educate yourself enough to know for sure you are on the "right side" of the TRUTH about public safety, earthen embankment dam rules, and why the Erie Canal needs to be repaired.

Because this is always true: Those who talk about topics they don't fully understand, like they are an expert on the subject matter, will eventually be found to be lacking in knowledge when pressed by those people who really are the experts, and have done their homework to learn about those topics.

Going on "gut feelings" and "valued opinion" can only go so far, it will never hold up against truth, science & facts
« Last Edit: March 19, 2021, 09:25:01 am by Doug K »

Doug K

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And of course the members of this Facebook group seem to INVENT explanations that they believe are suited to their cause.

Here the same group members are talking about something called 'plant blindness' that they must now think is the reason why the NYS Canal Corporation is doing all this EMBANKMENT DAM work along the Erie Canal.





If you open the article it's not really applicable to this particular situation along the Erie Canal where earthen embankments have been deemed "unsafe" and a "high hazard". And also these Earthen Dams do not comply with Federal or State Regulations, something again this BBC article doesn't have to consider as all.
.



But it does bring up another MAJOR issue with this Stop the Canal Clear-cut Group, and their own "blindness" to Unsafe Dams & General Public Safety Issues.

Luckily I was able to find an article that explains which "blindness" is worse for those that have it...lol. You just might want to take a look.




Sadly it's always hard for anyone to admit that they may have been wrong about a particular subject, or in this case, a public safety embankment program.

Let alone a group of people on Facebook, that have worked so hard to convince their members, that the lies they told themselves about canal embankments were true. And now they can't escape that foolishness, and refuse to believe they could have been so wrong protecting the "plants" that are causing all the issues along the Erie Canal, including making 100 year old earthen dams unsafe, and a high hazard to the community if a breach & flood should occur.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2021, 11:57:18 am by Doug K »

Doug K

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Look at the picture below, you all decide what's going on with this opposition group to Canal Safety on Facebook.

And this group's MEMBERS should also examine how obvious the bias is in the group's LEADERSHIP towards members who would praise the dam safety work being done, instead of belittling it, like STCC Leaders have done since Day 1, when they missed the "safety message".

Seems that a few Stop the Canal Clear-cut members actually LIKE the Canal Embankment changes to new "cleared" earthen embankment dams, with a restored privacy barrier.

And these members are also IMPRESSED by how well NYPA and the NY Canal Corporation have handled the final phase of their EERP (Earthen Embankment Restoration Project) work in Brockport and parts west of Rochester.

Privacy barrier planting is now in place, and being watered and cared for as promised.





Of course you won't find the name of even ONE of this Facebook group's leaders in the "like" list for comments made by these "happy" STCC members. That core team of leaders in this Facebook group, must be fuming, now that Erie Canal Neighbors on the westside actually received what was promised to them when this EERP project started.

And those STCC Leaders must also now realize that because of their shortsighted efforts to stop a public safety program, few if any Erie Canal Neighbors on the eastside of Rochester will have a chance at getting the same treatment, when embankments are cleared in Pittsford, Perinton & Fairport as part of the new EEIP program that is coming soon.

It's now become a well-known FACT that the opposition effort from this Facebook Group has actually caused the formation of new Earthen Embankment INTEGRITY Program, and a  whole new way to clear canal embankments, without the "restoration step" included.

If folks haven't noticed yet, the new EEI "program" does NOT have the word "restoration" included, so Erie Canal Neighbors, on the Eastside of town, will now have an uphill battle for a privacy screen planting after embankments have been cleared and planted with grass to restore their safety & integrity.

And those unfortunate Erie Canal neighbors can now form the line to "complain" about this "missed opportunity" right at source of the cause, the Facebook accounts of Ms Elizabeth Agte & Ms Ginny Maier and their misguided Stop the Canal Restoration Group.


Michael Caswell

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Still moaning. They planted TOO MANY TREES!
« Reply #4 on: May 05, 2021, 08:37:40 am »
Can you believe these people!



Of course, Ms Maier is an expert on tree planting.  I'm amazed at the 'talents' of this woman.   

And Brian Borowiec has his crystal ball out to make deadly predictions for the trees.  Really Brian! 

I see Eileen Pavia is also an expert on dam maintenance, and giving her valuable advice.  It doesn't jibe with the finding of the NYPA, ASDSO, FEMA and NYDEC, so I wonder where she gained her expertise?


It's all a huge comedy!
« Last Edit: May 05, 2021, 09:11:20 am by Doug K »

Doug K

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Re: Still moaning. They planted TOO MANY TREES!
« Reply #5 on: May 05, 2021, 03:42:45 pm »
A Comedy? Or maybe a Tragedy?

But I am right with you, it's time that the COMMUNITY these folks live in start to speak out about the lies being told regarding Public Safety & the Erie Canal.


https://ecna.createaforum.com/perinton-canal-embankment-discussion/perinton-facebook-group-says-there-are-too-many-trees-being-replanted/msg1473/?topicseen#msg1473
« Last Edit: May 05, 2021, 03:43:48 pm by Doug K »