Author Topic: Ms Gouldthorpe's perspective.  (Read 52 times)

Michael Caswell

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Ms Gouldthorpe's perspective.
« on: June 17, 2020, 12:34:25 pm »
You'll need to scroll down a little to find Janice's post. It starts of with an apology for her 'rant'.


I had a chuckle reading this stuff, and you probably will too. It's mainly grasping at straws, but this section in particular just shows how ignorant these people are.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/374651252977621/?epa=SEARCH_BOX

3) Protect the animals and environment:
Wildlife depend upon trees and woody habitat for survival
Plants and insects sustain our ecosystem for the good of all
Fish and other water species contribute to a healthy ecosystem
Water from the canal is used for agricultural irrigation
Cutting trees and vegetation will promote growth by invasive plant species
Control of these species with pesticides will cause loss of insect and animal life
Use of pesticides will result in contaminated runoff into the canal
These pesticides will end up in fish and agricultural crops that come from these waters.



Unfortunately, it looks like Janice has never actually looked closely at the vegetation. Most of the undergrowth is DSV, Amur Honeysuckle, Locust, and the real nightmare, that perfect junk tree Cottonwood. Couple those trees with the grape, bittersweet and poison ivy vines infesting these trees  canopies, and you have recipe for why there are so many trees losing limbs and being blown over.
The embankments are already infested with legally classified invasive species.

As for the pesticides, there is no evidence to suggest the Canal Corporation is using them, and even if they were, they would follow strict rules imposed by NYDEC.

It's all hogwash Janice!


« Last Edit: June 17, 2020, 12:40:21 pm by Michael Caswell »

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Michael Caswell

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Re: Ms Gouldthorpe's perspective.
« Reply #1 on: June 17, 2020, 02:02:04 pm »
To save you hunting all over their web page, I copied it! Here it is.
 
Janice Gouldthorpe
June 15 at 9:20 AM

Sorry for the very long post but this is a critical time! The latest from the Canal Corporation and what we know.
The New York State Canal Corporation has made it abundantly clear that they intend to continue on the same path to strip the canal of all vegetation.
They state “The New York State Canal Corporation is developing an embankment inspection and maintenance guidebook that will set forth protocols for safety, inspection, maintenance, community outreach and related environmental concerns, including a procedural approach as to where trees will be removed. While there will be a presumption that all trees and other unsuitable vegetation will be cleared to protect people and property, the guidebook will also recognize opportunities to consider alternatives to tree clearing in areas used for recreation, parks, municipal, residential and commercial areas. The New York State Canal Corporation has deemed preparation of this guidebook to be a “Type 1” action under SEQRA, subject to a full, and public, environmental review including a programmatic generic environmental impact statement. “
Yes, by the way, they only deemed that it is a Type 1 action to remove these trees after being sued by the towns of Perinton, Brighton and Pittsford who did so at the insistence of a group of committed citizens. They have not genuinely considered alternatives in their document nor have they bothered to listen to other facts presented from experts. This is a clear example of continued overreach by a state agency.
This fight is not over. They are ramping up again. Your help is needed to put pressure on your local and state officials. We only have until July 3 to give input to their plan.
If you feel strongly that the trees and vegetation should not be removed and that the NYSCC should put in place systems and funding to regularly inspect and maintain the canal with trees and vegetation, feel free to select one or more of the topic areas below that are of most concern to you. 
Write a letter to your town officials (supervisor, mayor, etc) and Governor Andrew Cuomo.  We have provided bullet points to help you with your letters.  Do It Now!

    Canal path users and local economy support:

The canal and the adjacent path are recreational parks for the people
Parks and people benefit from trees
A hot, dry canal path is the bane of bike riders and dog walkers and runners
Loss of shade will decrease use of the canal path
Decreased use of the canal path will result in less tourism
Less tourism for towns along the canal will mean less visitors and decreased economic vitality
Protect the economy by stopping men with machines from removing trees along the canal.

2) Trees are not the problem:
Trees have existed along the canal for over 100 years
The inspection and remediation systems along the canal have worked for over 100 years
Trees have not caused breeches in the canal
What has caused canal breeches are men with machines
Protect our communities by stopping men with machines from removing trees along the canal.

3) Protect the animals and environment:
Wildlife depend upon trees and woody habitat for survival
Plants and insects sustain our ecosystem for the good of all
Fish and other water species contribute to a healthy ecosystem
Water from the canal is used for agricultural irrigation
Cutting trees and vegetation will promote growth by invasive plant species
Control of these species with pesticides will cause loss of insect and animal life
Use of pesticides will result in contaminated runoff into the canal
These pesticides will end up in fish and agricultural crops that come from these waters
Protect our environment by stopping men with machines and chemicals from killing our habitats.

4) You own or wish to protect land next to the canal:
Trees provide screening, erosion control and windbreaks for properties along the canal
Loss of trees will contribute to erosion, wind damage, light and noise pollution for properties along the canal
Lack of privacy, shade and protection from these trees will contribute to loss of property values
Protect property values by stopping men with machines from removing trees along the canal.


All I can suggest is that Janice takes up something a little less challenging, like knitting baby socks, or doing something in the kitchen like making fairy cakes.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2020, 02:04:32 pm by Michael Caswell »

Doug K

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Take a read of that message to the Stop the Canal Clearcut group from it's leader, Ms. Gouldthorpe again, do it a couple times so you get all the messages she noted. Now let me ask a few questions...

Did you notice if Ms. Gouldthorpe  mentions the SAFETY issues for 327 property owners living below these embankment dams in the area from Lockport to Fairport?

No, because Ms G, like the rest of this group, seem to think that the people who use the Erie Canal trail part time for their walks, have MORE at stake than the neighbors of the Canal path living below those UNSAFE DAMS every day, 24 hours a day.

Did you happen to see if Ms. G used the word DAM in her speech about these trees, and the embankment dams that are now unsafe because of those trees?

No, because this group thinks that little detail isn't important. Dams, hills, highways, it's all the same to this group. Their leaders & members have managed to avoid using TWO of the three words that the NY Canal Corporation has stated is the REAL problem... UNSAFE EMBANKMENT DAMS. And of course it was all done under their "Shade is Cool" slogan.

Here's a slogan for you Ms. G.

SAFE DAMS SAVE LIVES...

It goes right next to this one...

TREES KILL EARTHEN DAMS

Go ahead, open the Menu and select the FIND... button. Type the word EMBANKMENT and see what you get... this group can't use that word either..because it reminds them of how wrong they are.Maybe worst of all, and it's all part of this 'subtle ignorance' this group has shown for quite a long time now...

Did you see even ONE mention of protecting HUMANS in Ms. Gouldthorpe's message?

No, because perhaps the only person who matters here is Mr. G and her little band of Environmentalist. These folks who would rather keep human lives & property at risk of floods, than to lose the shade for their precious walk each afternoon. There is never a mention of the safety of these canal neighbors, not only from floods but also the need to purchase Flood Insurance if the unsafe dams near them are NOT cleaned off.

The words Unsafe Embankment Dams don't just go away because some group says "save the trees' folks, remember that little fact when FEMA sends a letter saying your Flood Maps changed.

Hard to believe this group has convinced anyone they know what they are talking about, but they do have 605 followers... so what do I know?

Fairport, Perinton... shame on you for letting these folks keep your community living under Unsafe Embankment Dams.
« Last Edit: July 10, 2020, 09:59:06 am by Doug K »

Michael Caswell

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Re: Ms Gouldthorpe's perspective.
« Reply #3 on: July 10, 2020, 11:35:16 am »
"Shade is cool" logo. I'd prefer to say 'SHADY CHARACTERS'

I see Ms Gouldthorpe has sold her property on the canal by Rte 31F in Fairport.  Maybe she's moving away from the area? ;)

As for the 605 STCC members, we know many of them no longer support this group, but haven't bothered to sign off. I'd say there were about a dozen folks who really still peddle this dangerous philosophy!




« Last Edit: July 15, 2020, 06:04:48 pm by Michael Caswell »

Doug K

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Re: Ms Gouldthorpe's perspective.
« Reply #4 on: July 10, 2020, 04:42:27 pm »
We really don't know much about the STCC members, but 605 people have sided with a group that has one purpose:  fight to keep unsafe canal embankments  from being repaired.

Unsafe dams will eventually mean mandatory flood insurance in this country, especially with more and more earthen dam breaches happening at faster rates than ever. Infrastructure cumbling away matters most when it holds back flood water.

How many of those 605 people in tbe STCC membership actually live below these dams, that are a flood risk, and will be saddled with payments near $3000 annually?

All because the STCC wanted shade... wow.



« Last Edit: July 10, 2020, 04:58:25 pm by Doug K »

Doug K

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Just as we thought most people had understood the danger that this Facebook Group poses, along comes a 'newbie' who got sucked in by the group and it's leaders, who have been saying shade is the most important thing being lost.  And safety, well that word doesn't exist in the STCC and they do not want to talk about it, as you can see by the last posts.


Here's a comment on this Gouldthorpe Debacle, from a new member and someone who just realized his house is on a Dam, it's a very nice log home, in a very nice area, and all at risk of unsafe dam floods. I bet he never guessed why the LAST owner sold it so...and I bet that owner never mentioned the Unsafe Dam in his backyard... So much for NYS Property Disclosure statements.



Attention Mr. Micah Clark and family... if you are looking for help the STCC is the wrong group to ask for it

1) Their LEADERS won't help get you or your family out of danger from that unsafe canal dam your house is next to.

2) They won't be there to help you with mandatory flood insurance payments, if those trees don't get removed from that unsafe dam either.

3) They won't be there to throw you a life ring if your earthen dam starts to leak and breaches.

3) Many members don't even live below these canal embankment in danger like many of us homeowners are.

But it's America, you have choices.

You can listen to people who care more about shade for their walk than for your safety, or the safety of other Erie Canal Neighbors. Or you can get educated about the property you just purchased, how to make it safe, and how to make sure that Flood Insurance doesn't become something you never wanted to have.

I will help you out with a few pictures... and a suggestion that you visit the Canal Corporation website regarding the Embankment Integrity Program that will soon clear that ENTIRE embankment dam, south of your property. The link below will get you started.


http://www.canals.ny.gov/Earthen_Embankment/index.html

First understand that the canal is a prism, it's 120' across at the top and 75 feet across at the bottom. Water depth is around 12 feet. It hold quite a bit of water, and has flood gates that can only limit flood control to about 2 hours of water release. That's if they can get the gates closed at all as much of the Erie Canal system is aging, and need safety repairs, like these earthen embankment dams.

Here's how the volume of water is calculated in a prism...it's a calculator



But your property is special, because you have a wide waters. that's about 4. deep and used to yurn old barges around and store them for the winter months. So your property has MUCH more water than most. Here's a picture that will tell the WHOLE story and also ask the MOST important question,



If you want the truth, if you want the facts about Embankment Dam safety we can only offer the ECNA website as a starting place, and this ECNA Forum as a place that you can get questions answered, and concerns can be addressed.

Just offering you REAL facts and the TRUTH, protect your property and your family, understand just what you have gotten yourself into, and don't look for the STCC to offer any way to change that.

You bought a house below an Unsafe Erie Canal Embankment Dam... time to address safety issues, not shade.



https://ecna.us/
« Last Edit: July 11, 2020, 01:07:39 pm by Doug K »

Michael Caswell

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Re: Ms Gouldthorpe's perspective.
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2020, 02:13:59 pm »
It's the same old rhetoric! The STCC brainwashing a new convert, pitiful!



Doug K

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It boggles the mind... this Mr. Clark is asking his friends and family to write the Governor of NY State and ask to KEEP his own home in DANGER, and his FAMILY too.

Found this post on the STCC Facebook site, it says it all.




But as you can see those "details" , things many smart people call facts & truth, and rely on to make sound decisions, those little details are not important to this Facebook group.

Nor is the "history" of how and why Erie Canal EMBANKMENTS became Unsafe Embankments and how trees have played the key role creating the danger.

Nope, for the followers of the Stop the Canal Clear-Cut group it's "just tell me what to write Ms. Gouldthorpe and I'll do it".Or maybe ask Ms Agte,  she can tell you what to say and members really don't have to know if it's opinion or fact. Maybe they should all ask Ms. Virginia Borden Maier, she always has the answers, but it doesn't matter if she ignores community safety.

Public Safety appears to just be an insignificant detail to this group, and it's followers... wow.

« Last Edit: July 30, 2020, 08:04:47 am by Doug K »